Page Index Toggle Pages: [1] 2  Print
Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) No more biking in Pisgah!?!?! (Read 3066 times)
OoHoO
Little Ring
****
Offline


Gnar...Gnar...Gnar..

Posts: 696
Location: Charlotte
Joined: 08/21/13
No more biking in Pisgah!?!?!
12/11/15 at 1:16pm
Print Post  
Yes...the subject was meant to cause a feeling of angst and fear.  Please see the link below...any/all participation may be needed to help keep some of our best trail areas rideable.  We have recently seen trails in the western US get shut down to riders due to these same issues.

(You need to Login or Register to view media files and links)
  
(You need to Login or Register to view media files and links) (Attachment deleted)

2016 Santa Cruz Hightower CC 29 - Ridin' It
2014 Specialized Stumpjumper FSR 29 - Gone
2012 Cannondale Trail 6 - Gone
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
DK
Small Cog
***
Offline


Work Ride Tarheel Trailblazers

Posts: 348
Joined: 11/21/14
Re: No more biking in Pisgah!?!?!
Reply #1 - 12/11/15 at 1:59pm
Print Post  
There is an article about this same subject in bike magazine.  The movement to declare land as wilderness is a real threat to mountain bike trails and has already closed hundreds of miles of trails.  Interestingly bikes seem to be one of the main reasons according to what I've read even though horses will cause far more damage to trails than bikes will.  Voicing our concerns is going to be important to help prevent closures.
  
(You need to Login or Register to view media files and links) (Attachment deleted)

David

2016 Santa Cruz Tallboy C
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
TrillWill
IB Room
In The Loop
Project Board
Offline


THTB Board member 16'-23'
LKN TC

Posts: 1027
Location: Cornelius
Joined: 06/14/11
Re: No more biking in Pisgah!?!?!
Reply #2 - 12/11/15 at 2:01pm
Print Post  
The comment deadline is December 15th
  
(You need to Login or Register to view media files and links) (Attachment deleted)

Ride boards, ride bikes, ride life #shredeverything
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
JokerSC
Little Ring
****
Offline



Posts: 581
Location: Indian Land, SC
Joined: 07/31/09
Re: No more biking in Pisgah!?!?!
Reply #3 - 12/11/15 at 3:00pm
Print Post  
Can someone who has sent a response already post up what they sent? If we can make it easier for people to respond, we may get more people to do actually do it. I think a volume of responses would help our cause.

I won't have a chance to get a response written until sometime tomorrow.
  
(You need to Login or Register to view media files and links) (Attachment deleted)

RideMFRide
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Banjopickin
Big Ring
*****
Offline


Spinnin' knees & Hittin'
trees since '85

Posts: 1805
Location: Pisgah National Forest, USA
Joined: 08/01/11
Re: No more biking in Pisgah!?!?!
Reply #4 - 12/11/15 at 3:36pm
Print Post  
I went here to send my comments to the USFS...

(You need to Login or Register to view media files and links)

Its important to not send "general" emails describing your views. The USFS has a form that they prefer to be filled out for each area potentially affected by this. IMBA has made it easier in the link above.

"IMPORTANT: Your comments should follow the format that the Forest Service has requested on their form. Relevant sections of this form are outlined below for your information. To more easily make comment, copy the areas in bold into your e-mail and add the proposed wilderness areas which apply. A form to submit comments is at end of this post."

This is very important as Pisgah is one of the few remaining areas where we have so much access to high quality riding on USFS managed land. 

Dont sit by and let us lose Pisgah...  Smiley
  
(You need to Login or Register to view media files and links) (Attachment deleted)

Advocat wrote on 08/22/13 at 5:16pm:
...packin some Chub in the back of the pick-up.


(You need to Login or Register to view media files and links)
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
forkit
Coaster Bike
**
Offline


Work Ride Tarheel Trailblazers

Posts: 228
Location: s clt
Joined: 08/01/11
Re: No more biking in Pisgah!?!?!
Reply #5 - 12/11/15 at 4:48pm
Print Post  
Thanks for starting this thread.  I am against wilderness designations which exclude mechanized devices (used to be motorized devices)  ie mountain bikes.  The spirit of the wilderness act is to keep an area 'untrammeled' by man.  But if you have horse trails and hiking trails in a wilderness-designated-area, that is a definitive presence of man.  So what is this wilderness designation really about?  Sounds like a land grab by some elitists to me.   

I am sensitive to the fact that sometimes people want to go into an area and enjoy solitude from the rat race.  And maybe we should have a designated day for that, but not a complete lockout for an entire user group.

Looks like I'll be filling in some forms......
  
(You need to Login or Register to view media files and links) (Attachment deleted)
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Wears my bike
IB Room
In The Loop
Offline



Posts: 482
Location: Charlotte, NC
Joined: 02/05/12
Re: No more biking in Pisgah!?!?!
Reply #6 - 12/11/15 at 4:58pm
Print Post  
If you all want to submit your own comments, attached is the form you use per USFS. It was pretty convoluted to find this form and yes, the questions are clearly phrased with an agenda, but this is the formal the USFS request comments be submitted. 

I went ahead an added a section header (highlighted in yellow and name for each of the important inventory areas where mountain biking occurs and may be impacted. Note, if you submit this form ensure you save each section individually and submit the form per section. Your comments should be specific to each inventory area (Wilson creek, Harpers creek, Jarrett, south mills, cedar rock, etc) Completed forms may be submitted by email to [email protected] with the subject line: “Wilderness evaluation input,”...individually. 

I am going to work with the THTB board to formulate our response, at which time i will upload it for reference and usage.  

Also, if you want to send anything to anyone, here is the landuace from IMBA: 



Please consider the following comments regarding the evaluation phase of potential wilderness areas:

In response to Criteria 1c: The following proposed areas have a highly developed trail system which receives use by a wide variety of recreational groups: South Mills River, Daniel Ridge, Laurel Mountain, Cedar Rock Mountain, Woods Mountain, and Jarrett Creek

In response to Criteria 2a:The following areas have high recreational use and are close to populated areas which generate the high use of these areas of the forest: South Mills River, Daniel Ridge, Laurel Mountain, Cedar Rock Mountain, Woods Mountain, Jarrett Creek

In response to criteria 2b: The following areas contain mountain bike trails: Craggy, South Mills River, Daniel Ridge, Laurel Mountain, Cedar Rock Mountain, Harper Crk Ext/Sugar Knob, Woods Mountain, Jarrett Creek

In response to criteria 5c: Due to the amount of use that the trails in these areas receive it is most efficient to use mechanized equipment to keep them sustainable: Craggy Mountains outside the existing WSA, South Mills River, Daniel Ridge, Laurel Mountain, Cedar Rock Mountain, Sam Knob, Graveyard Ridge, Dobson Knob Ext, Woods Mountain, Jarrett Creek, Harper Creek, Steels Creek, Harper Crk Ext/Sugar Knob, Lost Cove, Upper Wilson Creek


Sincerely,
(Insert Name)
« Last Edit: 12/11/15 at 5:02pm by Wears my bike »  
(You need to Login or Register to view media files and links) fseprd476984__1_.docx (Attachment deleted)

I'm glad that this is an environment where you feel free to fail.
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Banjopickin
Big Ring
*****
Offline


Spinnin' knees & Hittin'
trees since '85

Posts: 1805
Location: Pisgah National Forest, USA
Joined: 08/01/11
Re: No more biking in Pisgah!?!?!
Reply #7 - 12/12/15 at 2:53pm
Print Post  
DONT WAIT!!!

The cut off is Dec. 15th...

Its extremely important that we all, as mountain bikers, send our comments to the USFS.

Even if you have never ridden Pisgah or Wilson Creek or anywhere in WNC for that matter we have to let the USFS know that we are serious about keeping trails open to bikes.

Every mile of trail we lose is one less mile that future generations of riders can enjoy. It doesnt just happen in Pisgah. We lost parts of Renni and an entire trail not that long ago.. RIP Poplar Tent! It could happen at Uwharrie too...

Lets not let that happen to Pisgah.

Mountain biking needs its community to stand up and make their voices heard for more access. 

Please use the link below to send your comments to the USFS and lets not lose these amazing trails right in our backyard Smiley

(You need to Login or Register to view media files and links)
« Last Edit: 12/12/15 at 3:04pm by Banjopickin »  
(You need to Login or Register to view media files and links) (Attachment deleted)

Advocat wrote on 08/22/13 at 5:16pm:
...packin some Chub in the back of the pick-up.


(You need to Login or Register to view media files and links)
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Doc00t
IB Room
In The Loop
Project Board
Offline


When in DOUBT, PEDAL it
OUT

Posts: 1785
Location: University
Joined: 05/09/12
Re: No more biking in Pisgah!?!?!
Reply #8 - 12/14/15 at 4:36am
Print Post  
Every few years the USFS takes a look around to see if they can convert more lands to Wilderness.  They identify territory, put it in a plan, and release it to the public for comment.  If their is not much push back then the land can be converted to "Wilderness".  

If you Hike or ride Horses this is fine because you still have access to the land.  If you want to ride your bike then you SOL.  How seriously is this enforced...very!  If your riding through the forest and come upon wilderness land, you are not even allowed to pick your bike up and carry it across the" Wilderness " territory.  

The Trails in Western part of the state are the pinnacle of MTBing  on the east coast and are very important to the sport we all love.  Help protect them by making your voice heard.  Follow the links to IMBA's site and help protect a Treasure!  The world is run by those who show up.  Now would be a good time to do just that.  The deadline is Dec 15th

(You need to Login or Register to view media files and links).
  
(You need to Login or Register to view media files and links) (Attachment deleted)

Scars are like Tattoos only with better Stories
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Mr.B
Coaster Bike
**
Offline



Posts: 69
Location: Brevard
Joined: 01/01/91
Re: No more biking in Pisgah!?!?!
Reply #9 - 12/14/15 at 3:28pm
Print Post  
Tom, can you post this to club news so the thread stays on top for today and tomorrow?
  
(You need to Login or Register to view media files and links) (Attachment deleted)
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
forkit
Coaster Bike
**
Offline


Work Ride Tarheel Trailblazers

Posts: 228
Location: s clt
Joined: 08/01/11
Re: No more biking in Pisgah!?!?!
Reply #10 - 12/14/15 at 4:13pm
Print Post  
I hate to sound pedantic, but the deadline is TODAY the 14th.....I don't want a bunch of responses getting thrown out due to bureaucratic bs.

"There are two ways you can submit comments at this time. We strongly urge you to submit comments BEFORE DECEMBER 15, 2015 for consideration."

  
(You need to Login or Register to view media files and links) (Attachment deleted)
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
forkit
Coaster Bike
**
Offline


Work Ride Tarheel Trailblazers

Posts: 228
Location: s clt
Joined: 08/01/11
Re: No more biking in Pisgah!?!?!
Reply #11 - 12/14/15 at 5:15pm
Print Post  
Here is imba's recommended areas to exclude from wilderness designation (link):

(You need to Login or Register to view media files and links)

I don't know how complete IMBA'S list is and I don't necessarily want to lose access to areas I haven't explored yet, so I just pasted them all into the form (text file attached, copy/paste if you want)  Just email to:

[email protected]
subject: Wilderness evaluation input
« Last Edit: 12/14/15 at 5:19pm by forkit »  
(You need to Login or Register to view media files and links) usfs-letter.txt (Attachment deleted)
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Unfated
Newbie
*
Offline



Posts: 34
Location: Matthews
Joined: 09/10/15
Re: No more biking in Pisgah!?!?!
Reply #12 - 12/14/15 at 9:20pm
Print Post  
Thanks for the reminder.  I just sent my comments in today.
  
(You need to Login or Register to view media files and links) (Attachment deleted)
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
TrillWill
IB Room
In The Loop
Project Board
Offline


THTB Board member 16'-23'
LKN TC

Posts: 1027
Location: Cornelius
Joined: 06/14/11
Re: No more biking in Pisgah!?!?!
Reply #13 - 12/14/15 at 10:40pm
Print Post  
forkit wrote on 12/14/15 at 5:15pm:
Here is imba's recommended areas to exclude from wilderness designation (link):

(You need to Login or Register to view media files and links)

I don't know how complete IMBA'S list is and I don't necessarily want to lose access to areas I haven't explored yet, so I just pasted them all into the form (text file attached, copy/paste if you want)  Just email to:

[email protected]
subject: Wilderness evaluation input

The IMBA form is pretty spot on and easy to submit, I would use it.    The areas noted on the map in the Wilson Creek area that contain mountain bike trails are:  Wilson Creek, Upper Wilson Creek, Lost Cove, Harper Creek, Harper Creek Ext/Sugar Knob, and Steels Creek.  Add those areas to supplement what IMBA mentioned.  I mentioned the fact that Highway 181 cuts through the proposed study areas and that highway (along with the numerous forest service roads) provide great access for a high volume of recreational users.   

I also added on that I supported the coalition of user groups that proposed creating two new National Recreation Areas in-lieu of Wilderness designation to preserve and enhance recreational uses such as mountain biking.

Get those comments in!
  
(You need to Login or Register to view media files and links) (Attachment deleted)

Ride boards, ride bikes, ride life #shredeverything
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Doc00t
IB Room
In The Loop
Project Board
Offline


When in DOUBT, PEDAL it
OUT

Posts: 1785
Location: University
Joined: 05/09/12
Re: No more biking in Pisgah!?!?!
Reply #14 - 12/15/15 at 1:02am
Print Post  
This article ran Saturday Citizen-Times 

Groups propose recreation areas on WNC national forests

(You need to Login or Register to view media files and links)

The Trailblazers were asked to support this effort this afternoon at the zero hour before the official paperwork was turned in.  Technically we were already in support by being a SORBA-IMBA chapter but the Trailblazers officially were added along with TORC(Triangle) and Boone Area Cyclist to the official list.  Long Live Long Rides!
  
(You need to Login or Register to view media files and links) (Attachment deleted)

Scars are like Tattoos only with better Stories
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Unfated
Newbie
*
Offline



Posts: 34
Location: Matthews
Joined: 09/10/15
Re: No more biking in Pisgah!?!?!
Reply #15 - 12/15/15 at 2:20am
Print Post  
Doc00t wrote on 12/15/15 at 1:02am:
This article ran Saturday Citizen-Times 

Groups propose recreation areas on WNC national forests

(You need to Login or Register to view media files and links)

The Trailblazers were asked to support this effort this afternoon at the zero hour before the official paperwork was turned in.  Technically we were already in support by being a SORBA-IMBA chapter but the Trailblazers officially were added along with TORC(Triangle) and Boone Area Cyclist to the official list.  Long Live Long Rides!

No surprise that the first comment on the Citizen Times article comes from Mike Vandenam.  Did someone say Beetlejuice's name 3 times or something?
  
(You need to Login or Register to view media files and links) (Attachment deleted)
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
mountainbiker90
Small Cog
***
Offline


Is it 5 yet??

Posts: 384
Joined: 01/22/06
Re: No more biking in Pisgah!?!?!
Reply #16 - 12/15/15 at 4:38am
Print Post  
Just saw this. Form submitted. Thank you for bringing this up. Was completely unaware of the proposed wilderness crap affecting pisgah.
« Last Edit: 12/15/15 at 4:39am by mountainbiker90 »  
(You need to Login or Register to view media files and links) (Attachment deleted)

Yeah, to the best of my knowledge:)
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Doc00t
IB Room
In The Loop
Project Board
Offline


When in DOUBT, PEDAL it
OUT

Posts: 1785
Location: University
Joined: 05/09/12
Re: No more biking in Pisgah!?!?!
Reply #17 - 12/15/15 at 3:48pm
Print Post  
Final Day to Submit Comments is Now!
  
(You need to Login or Register to view media files and links) (Attachment deleted)

Scars are like Tattoos only with better Stories
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
abruzzopat
Little Ring
****
Offline


Irritating animated GIF...
I'll remove it soon.

Posts: 519
Location: Belmont, NC
Joined: 06/29/14
Re: No more biking in Pisgah!?!?!
Reply #18 - 12/15/15 at 4:06pm
Print Post  
As Tom mentioned above, we have been added to a coalition of interested groups including Mountain Bikers, Wilderness proponents, horsemen, etc. The coalition worked together to present a memorandum of understanding (MOU) which was released December 8th.

This proposal recommends creating two new National Recreation Areas (Pisgah and Grandfather) which would allow mountain biking and would protect the majority of the trails up there. The MOU also recommends about 109,000 acres be designated as Wilderness, but those areas do not currently have mountain bike trails.

This site is the best source of information about the coalition and the MOU: (You need to Login or Register to view media files and links)

IMO, bringing together these groups (who often have conflicting agendas) was a great achievement, and this MOU is where we should be focusing our energy. It represents the best path toward saving our trails up there.
« Last Edit: 12/15/15 at 4:07pm by abruzzopat »  
(You need to Login or Register to view media files and links) (Attachment deleted)
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Gravitythief76
In The Loop
Project Board
*****
Offline


Just say no to Man-dex

Posts: 2151
Location: Dirt Monkey - Root Ent
Joined: 03/06/08
Re: No more biking in Pisgah!?!?!
Reply #19 - 12/15/15 at 5:02pm
Print Post  
Does the recreational area classification prohibit extractive use? I.e. logging mining energy exploration etc.
  
(You need to Login or Register to view media files and links) (Attachment deleted)

(You need to Login or Register to view media files and links)

I'M STILL ALIVE!!!!
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Page Index Toggle Pages: [1] 2 
Print