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AMitchell47
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How much (or how seriously) do you train?
02/10/17 at 3:35pm
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I'm new to mountain bike racing, and raced the first 3 races of the short track series this year in Beginner Men over 40.  My lap times in the last race were around 4:10/lap.  I'd like to make the leap to the sport class next year if I am fit enough when the time comes, but figure I'll have to get more focused to do it.   

I started riding more  last summer, and usually get in three rides a week. At least one of those is a slow, social ride with some friends.  One will be a full out sprint at Sherman or Rocky River by myself.  Average mileage is probably 30 to 40 miles per week.  I do some intervals on a spin bike for 30 or 40 minutes at lunch time during the work week when I can fit them in, but only started that recently.

I look at the Sport Men over 40 class, and the top 5 are running at least 20 seconds a lap faster than I am, AND going 4 laps further.  I'm dead after my 30 minutes!

Folks in the Sport class - how do you train?  Do you follow a guideline or book from a particular person, or just ride as much as you can in the time you have?  Do you ride 50 plus miles a week?

Any recommendations on a training plan for the working guy with a job and a family?  I'm hoping I can just get a little more focused with the time I do ride to get more out of it.  Any advice would be appreciated.  If it becomes too much like a job - I'll probably just chill out, keep it fun, and race once in a while.  I love pushing myself, but want to try and keep a mix of fun and training if I can.


  
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Re: How much (or how seriously) do you train?
Reply #1 - 02/10/17 at 4:42pm
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I'm interested to see responses to this as well.  Especially from the "older" age group as I feel like the teens and 20 something's have a lot more free time than people in their 30's with wives, kids, mortgages, etc.  I honestly don't know how people can squeeze in more than 3 rides a week.  Especially "long" rides.

Following...
  
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Re: How much (or how seriously) do you train?
Reply #2 - 02/10/17 at 5:50pm
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Expect to hear a super broad range of trainign regimens...

I used to "train" but rarely race now but here are few things that helped me...

1. cleaning my eating up... ALOT. You have to fuel your body well. No junk, no added sugar, no beer (or at least not 4 a day haha). Get strict... lean meat, tons of veggies, carbs for fuel. Drink a ton of water... 

2. Dont focus too much on the bike. I guarantee Peter Sagan would crush all of us on a 20" Mongoose from Walmart. Its the rider, not the equipement. Keep your bike clean, and well tuned though. You will feel so much faster when your drive train is silent, the brakes are perfectly aligned, and the tire pressure is dialed. That stuff is much more important than worrying about 5 gram difference in grips or some nonsense.

3. Keep training fun. There are a million ways to train for cycling. There are a million ways to make cycling suck and not fun too. However you choose to train, keep it fun. dont just do trainer rides or long trail rides or intervals. I made a schedule where I would do intervals on my trainer 2x a week and do at least one or two hard rides at 80% effort or more once a week (usually 2-3 laps at Beatty), and always at least one fun ride with no agenda other than enjoyment. Train on a variety of trails to mix it up. You will get so bored with training that it may very well make riding less fun so try to avoid that.

4. Rest. Get a ton of rest. Your body needs to recover and when youre over 40 it takes longer than when your 25...duh haha. Rest alot and do yoga. Yoga helped me so much when I was doing 100 mile weeks on the trail. 20 min a day at least. Treat your body like a fine tuned machine and it will perform that way.

Lastly, and I think what will help the most is, get with a group of riders who are faster than you and ride with them alot. You will get dropped a ton at first but just try your best to stay with them. You will get crazy fast and pretty soon youre keeping up, and eventually passing them. 

...I will never forget the first time I rode with Enoch at Sherman. Me on my beater 26er" rigid SS. My best lap prior was 1:06 or so which I thought was quick. We took off like a shot out of the parking lot and I did my best to stay on his wheel. We finished the lap and I was destroyed... but spun a 55min lap! From there on I knew I could do sub-hour laps there, and it totally opened my mind to what I could do on my bike. Next came riding with heavy hitters in Pisgah which really improved my bike handling. Ride with people better than you and you will get faster.

But seriously keep it fun...

« Last Edit: 02/10/17 at 5:58pm by Banjopickin »  
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Advocat wrote on 08/22/13 at 5:16pm:
...packin some Chub in the back of the pick-up.


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Re: How much (or how seriously) do you train?
Reply #3 - 02/10/17 at 5:56pm
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Here is my input. 

I race short track to make my adventure rides/races more fun. I love short track races as it is a great interval workout. But this series is not the reason I ride. I ride for big adventure rides in Pisgah, Wilson, and where ever. Its a great fitness test and motivator to become a better rider, so i fit it into my schedule as a training ride to give it everything I have. The other rides during the week are 2 or 3 long rides of 3+ hours (one on the road or zwift and one on the mountain bike) and an hour at total cyclist (I can't recommend TC strongly enough for any rider). 

So my typical goal week right now is Short track, Rest, Total Cyclist, Rest, Cross Train, Long Ride, Long Ride, repeat. My end goal is Pisgah 111, Stage Races, ORAMM to build for a big stage race in August. 

So ultimately it depends on what your personal goals are and what you want to be good at. Do you want to be a short track slayer, endurance rider, or are you using it as training to become a better rider overall to make adventure rides more enjoyable.   

If it helps, here is also my progression on my 4th year racing short track. The first year was Beginner 19-39 having never raced before and I won the series so decided year 2 to move to sport. When I moved up to sport in year 2 i was lapped and had my ass handed to me. I did not like that feeling and used it as motivation to ride more. Year 3 I was in the top 5 typically after using a training program above, but eating like poop. My only goal that year was not to get lapped and it turned out to be fairly competitive. In year 4 (this year) my goals are to compete in stage races, so using the above i am racing both Sport and Single Speed to increase endurance. In sport I am inconsistent with my best finish being 4th and worst a DNF last week having not felt right. 

But my goal is not to be a great short track racer, just use it as a training ride. So you need to know what you want and then set a plan from there. Below is a link to some free options posted by British Cycling as a starting point. Find a plan, try it for 6-12 weeks and go from there. Personally i am on the 12 week foundation plan and can feel myself become a much stronger overall rider. Later I will focus on a plan to increase my strength as a hill climber, as this is my weakness as a rider.   

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Sorry if that was long winded.
  
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I'm glad that this is an environment where you feel free to fail.
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Re: How much (or how seriously) do you train?
Reply #4 - 02/10/17 at 5:59pm
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This!!!

Banjopickin wrote on 02/10/17 at 5:50pm:
Expect to hear a super broad range of trainign regimens...

I used to "train" but rarely race now but here are few things that helped me...

1. cleaning my eating up... ALOT. You have to fuel your body well. No junk, no added sugar, no beer (or at least not 4 a day haha). Get strict... lean meat, tons of veggies, carbs for fuel. Drink a ton of water... 

2. Dont focus too much on the bike. I guarantee Peter Sagan would crush all of us on a 20" Mongoose from Walmart. Its the rider, not the equipement. Keep your bike clean, and well tuned though. You will feel so much faster when your drive train is silent, the brakes are perfectly aligned, and the tire pressure is dialed. That stuff is much more important than worrying about 5 gram difference in grips or some nonsense.

3. Keep training fun. There are a million ways to train for cycling. There are a million ways to make cycling suck and not fun too. However you choose to train, keep it fun. dont just do trainer rides or long trail rides or intervals. I made a schedule where I would do intervals on my trainer 2x a week and do at least one or two hard rides at 80% effort or more once a week (usually 2-3 laps at Beatty), and always at least one fun ride with no agenda other than enjoyment. Train on a variety of trails to mix it up. You will get so bored with training that it may very well make riding less fun so try to avoid that.

4. Rest. Get a ton of rest. Your body needs to recover and when youre over 40 it takes longer than when your 25...duh haha. Rest alot and do yoga. Yoga helped me so much when I was doing 100 mile weeks on the trail. 20 min a day at least. Treat your body like a fine tuned machine and it will perform that way.

Lastly, and I think what will help the most is, get with a group of riders who are faster than you and ride with them alot. You will get dropped a ton at first but just try your best to stay with them. You will get crazy fast and pretty soon youre keeping up, and eventually passing them. 

...I will never forget the first time I rode with Enoch at Sherman. Me on my beater 26er" rigid SS. My best lap prior was 1:06 or so which I thought was quick. We took off like a shot out of the parking lot and I did my best to stay on his wheel. We finished the lap and I was destroyed... but spun a 55min lap! From there on I knew I could do sub-hour laps there, and it totally opened my mind to what I could do on my bike. Next came riding with heavy hitters in Pisgah which really improved my bike handling. Ride with people better than you and you will get faster.

But seriously keep it fun...


  
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Re: How much (or how seriously) do you train?
Reply #5 - 02/10/17 at 6:06pm
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Training sucks.  I like to ride to much to turn it into I have to do and a certain way to do it.   I try to hit a bike 5 / 6 days a week as possible.  Some of those are roadie rides with some distance.   

I've decided if I'm a mid pack sport rider (or single speed), then I'm ok with that.  I just enjoy the competition.
  
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Re: How much (or how seriously) do you train?
Reply #6 - 02/10/17 at 6:33pm
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Quote:
I've decided if I'm a mid pack sport rider (or single speed), then I'm ok with that.  I just enjoy the competition.


I think I may find myself ending up there as well.  The information so far has been helpful.  Interesting that I totally forgot to think about eating - I've been trying to improve on that lately as well.  Less Sugar, Less junk.

I've heard good things about Total Cyclist - sounds like they teach you how to train.   

You need a road bike to train there, right?  Or could I get a road wheel for my mountain bike?

Super food for thought so far, many thanks, and keep it coming!
  
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Re: How much (or how seriously) do you train?
Reply #7 - 02/10/17 at 8:27pm
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Banjo has the right approach, I'll try and add my two cents since it is Friday and I'm watching the clock while I'm working Smiley

I'd like this to serve as a generic reply to anyone that is thinking "how can I get faster?" It's such a broad question and the answer of "get a coach" is not the right one for maybe 90% of the people who are asking it.

Some background of me since I'm new here:

I trained for two straight years for CX and XC MTB after 5 years of JRAing. I was able to go from a newb to doing my first Cat 1 race in MTB, some 6 hour races and even a 100 mile race, just by riding, not training. 5 years is a long time, but when I look back, It never felt like a chore it was fun exploring new trails, meeting new people, checking out new race venues, all that stuff. Being fast and fit is awesome, but at what expense? Coaches cost money, doing intervals by yourself is lonely and hard to stay motivated. This is amateur bike racing. Remember that.

If you want to do this for a long time, training right now is not the answer. You WILL burn out and hate bikes. 

My tip? Find a group of like minded individuals. Maybe people you race, people on this board, whatever. Get out and ride with them. You will push each other and have fun doing it. Even be a little competitive. Talk trash. This is the answer, not doing intervals by yourself at this level in your fitness level/cycling life. 

By the time I thought about getting a coach, I hit a plateau in my fitness. I wasn't getting any faster. I cut out soda and stopped eating fast food. I dropped 10 pounds without doing anything different. Then I dove in head first. I had awesome results on CX, had some great fitness for a bunch of endurance races, it was addicting. This year we had our first child and I was unsure how it would go. I decided to ditch training for anything specific because it's bike racing, it is suppose to be fun. I did the first 3 ST races in the SS category with hardly any real riding and had a BLAST. Could I have been faster? Maybe. I wasn't doing intervals and just rode for fun for an hour at lunch. No lie. The key is I had fun and it wasn't a chore to do these races. As someone who has been racing since '09, it felt strange to really "enjoy" the race.

The benefits of a coach are the time management and every minute you spend on a bike, you are working towards a goal at a race. You do not have to second guess if you are pushing too hard or if you should be taking it easy, someone does all of that for you.

Now this sounds great, since you are time crunched, but remember, I did this after 5 years of JRAing. It does become a chore. You do not enjoy riding anymore. You dread the workouts and enjoy the days you aren't riding. You are living for these races and if you don't do well, you hate it even more. Do not go down this fox hole in your short cycling career. 

I don't know you and you don't know me, but I think this should be your path:

Get a road bike. Check out some group rides. Ride in the group that pushes you justttt past that comfort zone. Progress in them. 99% of the MTB racing is going to rely on fitness at the beginner/sport level. The road bike is a key aspect of this fitness.

Can you ride an hour a day? Or 6 out of 7 days a week? Ride hard on the road, slow on the MTB, hard, roll on the spin bike. whatever. Just pedal your bike. When you are tired, ride easy. When you are with your friends, try and make them suffer. Don't focus on miles, focus on hours. 10 miles at RRT vs 30 miles on the road = apples and oranges. I wouldn't focus on any specific structured work out. Maybe only on the spin bike, because that thing is torture. If it makes the time go by faster, by all means, have at it. 

There isn't a secret formula or certain amount of hours you need to ride to get faster, faster than everyone else. You need to ride your bike. Do not over think it. When the time comes, you'll know. It sounds like you are on the right path with the spin bike and social rides. Find that hour a day to ride and keep at it!

Also, there is no shape in moving up and being a mid pack sport rider. In all honesty, if you are on the podium of a Beginner category, you should move up to let the people who are true beginners gain the confidence that they can do this too. The goal is to progress and get faster, not hurt yourself staying in the same category!

Wow, I can't believe I wrote so much, I apologize!
« Last Edit: 02/10/17 at 8:33pm by pearl »  
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Re: How much (or how seriously) do you train?
Reply #8 - 02/10/17 at 11:02pm
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Unless you are in it for the points in beginner, go ahead and move up. You're lap times aren't that far off. It'll make you faster.
  
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Re: How much (or how seriously) do you train?
Reply #9 - 02/11/17 at 3:57am
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Well said Pearl. I've been riding for over 20 years. Last real racing experience was about 10 yrs ago. Was racing expert and the training took the fun completely out of it. 

For racing solidly at the sport level, you will need to ride more than you do right now. My advice would be to make friends with a few guys that can push your limits. Ride with them at least 1x per week. If you can't find any folks you could always find a road ride that challenges your fitness. 

There is always the coaching, intervals, and training regiments but that wasn't for me.  My goals now are to have fun and to be fast enough to hang with my buddies.
  
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Re: How much (or how seriously) do you train?
Reply #10 - 02/11/17 at 12:42pm
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Love the topic, always wonder about other riders training logic and regime. 

I enter races when possible and typically do Expert (Summer Series and WST). Finished in the top 3 several times but that's depending on who turns up!. This book helped me get a schedule together and try different training methods, The Mountain Biker's Training Bible by Joe Friel.  It talks about quality time versus time on the bike and how rest is key. It made me realize I didn't need to ride 10-15hrs a week on the bike to be somewhat competitive in local races.  I typical get 4-7hrs a week, its a mix of the trainer, spin classes and Athletic conditioning. Time on the trail is tough with work and 2 little ones. When I do get out there it's purely for fun. 

Nutrition is key, like most folk mentioned. Once I cleaned my diet up, I was putting in faster times with less time on the bike. Not terribly clean, beer is too awesome to give up on. Also race fuel, I played around with different products and feel it helps my performance. 

I'll be at race 5 hanging in the B-Line tent if you want to chat. 

Cheers



  
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Re: How much (or how seriously) do you train?
Reply #11 - 02/11/17 at 2:50pm
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All great advice so far.  I think what I really seek is advice so I can get a little more out of my rides, and be a solid mid-level sport guy, and still have fun.

I do get enjoyment out of pushing myself, and occasionally racing.  I have no desire of becoming the top level winning expert and training 15 hours a week, or racing every week.  I could see riding 7-10 hours per week, doing the winter series (when the weather is nice) and most of the summer series, and maybe a race in the fall like the couch potato.

Thanks for the input.  I was looking at the Friel book.  I do have a couple "faster friends" that I need to try to ride with more often, and have recently decided that eating like a teenager doesn't suit me well.

Hopefully with the advice here, a little more focus, better diet, I can make some improvements this year.  It's pretty cool to be getting genuine feedback from a group of people I don't even know!  Go trailblazers!
  
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Re: How much (or how seriously) do you train?
Reply #12 - 02/11/17 at 3:21pm
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FYI, you do not need to ride for 15 hours a week to be a competitor in the expert fields. 

No more reading, go out and chase your friends!
  
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